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[mrsdawnrazor]

My husand is 44 and left home at 15 due to an overbearing father. Now we live on the other side of the world, have 2 kids that do not know one set of grandparents because of the damage done in the years from 15-18.
They withdrew their financial and emotional support from him because he wouldnt conform to their ideals so he left and made his own life. He is an only child and his parents have no close family, and ultimately they are the ones who missed out. We have a loving and close family on my side who have welcomed him in to our lives. The contrast between his upbringing and mine was huge but we both got drunk, both experimented with drugs both got ourselves into situations that were a bit sticky, but the difference was, I knew pretty much what ever I did, my parents may not approve but would always be there for me.

The comment about withdrawing emotional and financial support sent shivers down my spine - too reminiscent of my husband's situation but in the end it is his parents who have suffered more.

 

[JamesGG]

The comment about withdrawing emotional and financial support sent shivers down my spine

+1.

It may be a little idealistic, but I would usually think that it's when someone really messes up that they need such support the most. But then, I don't have any kids yet, so perhaps I'm simply yet to learn that the hard line is best in the long run, after all...

 

[vincenzo]

...By saying "by the time they are teenagers" implys that from age 13 onwards you are going to just sit back and hope that what you have taught them will guide them...

Um yeah, that's exactly what I meant

I never said you can't still be a parent, as in teach, listen, encourage, respect, etc, all the good stuff. [/captainobvious]

But maybe I just don't know what i'm talking about

Maybe I should have values more like some grandparents and great grandparents, that would raise a child using kettle cords or belts or other objects to control children through torture?

And would raise a child under a strict regime, and if the child refuses to comply, or if once thier child becomes an adult, if a mistake is ever made, they would disown the child completely?

Maybe I should also think that just because a child is not completely independant, that they are not entitled to any sort of authority over thier own lives?

Maybe I should have values more like some grandparents and great grandparents, or great great grandparents, back when men were the breadwinners, and a womens job was to cook, clean and raise children?

Maybe we could all do well to take on the values of our primitive ancestors?
This might seem suffocating, but just maybe, it would help all of us to become better parents and partners!?!?!?!

 

[skater]

+1.

It may be a little idealistic, but I would usually think that it's when someone really messes up that they need such support the most. But then, I don't have any kids yet, so perhaps I'm simply yet to learn that the hard line is best in the long run, after all...

I think different things work for different families, for different reasons. The trick is finding what works for yours when there is a crisis.

You also have to deal with different personalities. It would be ideal if all your kids had a similar personality. Find what works, then stick to it. Trouble is, you will find that all your kids are different, and what works really well for one, is the exact opposite to what works for another.

I gave both mine the same opportunities and expected the same from both of them in regards to behaviour, boundaries, respect for self and others, etc. Yet they have both chosen completely different paths. One, I am very proud of the latest life decisions and the way she is handling obstacles, the other, well, shall we just say, is still working things out, if you know what I mean?

 

[skater]

Um yeah, that's exactly what I meant

I never said you can't still be a parent, as in teach, listen, encourage, respect, etc, all the good stuff. [/captainobvious]

But maybe I just don't know what i'm talking about

Maybe I should have values more like some grandparents and great grandparents, that would raise a child using kettle cords or belts or other objects to control children through torture?

And would raise a child under a strict regime, and if the child refuses to comply, or if once thier child becomes an adult, if a mistake is ever made, they would disown the child completely?

Maybe I should also think that just because a child is not completely independant, that they are not entitled to any sort of authority over thier own lives?

Maybe I should have values more like some grandparents and great grandparents, or great great grandparents, back when men were the breadwinners, and a womens job was to cook, clean and raise children?

Maybe we could all do well to take on the values of our primitive ancestors?
This might seem suffocating, but just maybe, it would help all of us to become better parents and partners!?!?!?!

Hmmm......well, speaking from the coal face, as a parent that has gone through the troubling teen years, I can seriously tell you that you may find your views changing when that time comes.

In all honesty, I can tell you that if I had had that approach then one, if not both of my children would be living very different lives to the ones they are living today.

The problem is not your own child, and the values that you have taught them. The real problem comes from outside the family. Do not underestimate the power of peer pressure. Your child is in the company of others from 9am - 3pm five days a week. Then there is Facebook, Bebo, etc, mobile phones and who knows what else by the time your young ones get to that age.

 

[battler]

Two things,
1) you are a parent forever,

2) you can over nurture them also....my brother is still at home with mum and dad and he's 58!

 

[WinstonWolfe]

He is an only child and his parents have no close family, and ultimately they are the ones who missed out.

It sends shivers up my spine that you believe you hold the high moral ground when you and your husband are punishing both his parents 26 years later for the behavior of one of them. There's no forgiveness and understanding in that whatsoever.

 

[WinstonWolfe]

Maybe I should have values more like some grandparents and great grandparents, that would raise a child using kettle cords or belts or other objects to control children through torture?

And maybe you could just rely on the gubmint to pick up the pieces of your kids messing with drugs, crime, and screwing up financially.

No wonder Australia needs a big welfare safety net.

 

[Corey Batt]

And maybe you could just rely on the gubmint to pick up the pieces of your kids messing with drugs, crime, and screwing up financially.

No wonder Australia needs a big welfare safety net.

You believe that if you don't enforce corporal punishment on a child they will end up doing drugs, being criminals and bad at money?

 

[mrsdawnrazor]

Who said we were punishing them?
We got on with our own lives and by the time they were interested we were on the other side of the world. I just hope this doesnt happen to you with your son.
Parents do not have an automatic right to be part of their children's lives after they have left home. In the same way a child needs to earn the parent's trust after it has been broken, so a parent will need to work to regain trust. The relationship has changed from Child - Adult to Adult- Adult.

You obviously had a good relationship with your parents but if this is not the case then a parent cannot expect to pick up where they left off because they now think everything is OK.

 

[WinstonWolfe]

You believe that if you don't enforce corporal punishment on a child they will end up doing drugs, being criminals and bad at money?

In the same way a child needs to earn the parent's trust after it has been broken, so a parent will need to work to regain trust.

I think there is something developmentally delayed about kids/adolescents who expect unconditional parental love, no matter their actions. It more often spills over to expecting same from society, teachers, employers, police, courts. It is quite pathetic actually.

 

[mrsdawnrazor]

If you read what I wrote and you quoted I dont see any reference to unconditional love or trust. My point is it needs to be earned but on both sides.

Its a matter of respect - from child to parent AND from Parent to child

 

[vincenzo]

I didn't realise that your parenting style was that much different to mine Skater

I agree with honestly teaching as much as possible, about as many things as possible, in an unbiased and preferably fun and interesting way. Not keeping things secret or taboo to avoid uncomfortable topics.

I agree with immediate posistive reinforcement to encourage good behaviour, and immediately punishing bad behaviour, followed by discussion about why that behaviour was inappropriate. Punishments such as removing rewards or asigning chores, not things like reading thier personal diary entries or emails or listening to thier private conversations, or whipping them, or other disrespectful behaviour.

I agree with giving kids responsibilities as they age, and respecting what they want, not trying to completely control them... unlike some people...

And maybe you could just rely on the gubmint to pick up the pieces of your kids messing with drugs, crime, and screwing up financially.

No wonder Australia needs a big welfare safety net.

I've met a fair few kids that are either living off the government, or a life of drugs, a bit of crime, and alot of financial screw ups.

Most had either disrespectful parents, that either totally ignored them, or tried to control them, or parents that just spoiled them rotten. Sometimes there was only one parent, who had to work long hours, and/or alot of negative peer influences, so being a parent was not an easy task.

I've met lots of people that have much to be proud of in many if not all aspects of thier life. Some of them didn't have alot of support from thier parents, but most of them had parents that brought them up without disrepecting them.

So there are very succesfull people out there that had a very tough upbringing, but I don't think that means the correct way to bring up a child, is to make life hell, and see if they sink or swim.

Spoiling a child is just as pathetic as torturing them, just not as barbaric. Neither are correct imo.

 

[WinstonWolfe]

So there are very succesfull people out there that had a very tough upbringing, but I don't think that means the correct way to bring up a child, is to make life hell, and see if they sink or swim.

Spoiling a child is just as pathetic as torturing them, just not as barbaric. Neither are correct imo.

I can only presume the extreme and bizarre slant you put on my views is indicative of some unresolved issue you have with authority.

 

[willair]

Why go to this extreme when you can simply check for trackmarks .
No true druggie is going to waste this drug on swallowing it.

Seriously, if this is one of their drugs of choice, you're going to know they're on drugs and hanging out with serious druggies well before the need for a strand of hair.

I doubt narcotics is a big issue in private schools.

The Private School System hides a lot that happens within the School Gates after all if you want the punters to come in from day one and pay above 14k per child for 12 years then it has to be a clean slate,,,maybe it's just me just like walking down the any street everyone sees different items,but if you know what to look for it stands out like dogs b####..
After all if you do the numbers on the amount of Med Proff that send their offspring into the P S System,and their way of fixing any problem is just throw more cash on the bonfire,Most just don't know the problem till it's far too late..

good luck willair..

 

[Luv2Travel]

There's lots of 'this is the right way, that is the wrong way' going on here. I don't have children, but I don't think there's one set of rules. As Skater said, every child is different and responds to different things. From myself growing up, my brother and I have the same parents, in the same household, but we are both two very different people who needed different types of discipline. My brother had pretty severe A.D.D. and so you couldn't just sit him down and reason with him. I on the other hand, was the perfect child... . And seeing now with my niece and nephew who are 4 and 5, the boy you can sit down and reason with and he is really good, but the little girl can be a bit of a brat and doesn't respond so much, so she gets the time out when she's with me.

And Vincenzo, call me old fashion but I believe in a good smack on the bum or hand if all else fails. There's a huge difference between discipline and barbaric child abuse!

 

[Simon]

After all if you do the numbers on the amount of Med Proff that send their offspring into the P S System,and their way of fixing any problem is just throw more cash on the bonfire,Most just don't know the problem till it's far too late..

Where would I find those numbers?

 

[Simon]

You obviously had a good relationship with your parents but if this is not the case then a parent cannot expect to pick up where they left off because they now think everything is OK.

Yes. You cannot expect to have a good relationship with a teenager if all you do is demand it be so because of the accident of birth that labels you a mother/father. It does involve a lot of work and communication.

 

[willair]

Where would I find those numbers?

Sit outside the school each afternoon for 14 years prior too picking them up each day-- day in day out and over the years as you see the young kids grow up and you sit there with other parents you get to hear all interesting items that only the inner circle of the schools know about,
plus Simon it also helps to sit beside some high ranking Qld Police each afternoon for the whole 14 years after all the Police that are in the Drug Squad don't think like everyone else they see it every day,but you would already know that ..willair..

 

[vincenzo]

I can only presume the extreme and bizarre slant you put on my views is indicative of some unresolved issue you have with authority.

I'm not the one defending my actions with reports of abuse administered by my parents.
I'm also not trying to pretend that spying on my childrens conversations isn't extreme or bizzare.

And Vincenzo, call me old fashion but I believe in a good smack on the bum or hand if all else fails. There's a huge difference between discipline and barbaric child abuse!

Yes not all kids are the same, some are very difficult to handle, and I've smacked disobedient children on the bum.
It always worked, but I won't pretend that it was the best way to handle the situation, it was me running out of patience, and going for the quick, convenient, barbaric and easy way out.

I'm proud of the many times, i've sorted out disobedient children, from toddlers to teenagers, just by interacting with them.
Dealing with misbehaving adults can be more difficult, sometimes I've threatened to smack them and it worked, but again that's not the best way to deal with people.