All of the things above and the biggest problem is: Lack of parental discipline.
Regards JO
whats happening to australia?
- Thread starter gg1965
- Start date
All of the things above and the biggest problem is: Lack of parental discipline.
Regards JO
or the kid doing the bullying got a good retort, was embarrassed, and tried to do something about it to save face.
Grannies getting raped isn't a new phenomenan (sp?). In my first job out of school c 1984, a woman I worked with had a grandmother who had been raped and bashed in her own home 3 times. She refused to go to a nursing home or a relatives at first. At the time the incidents barely made the paper here.
I have to agree with you gg1965 about kids respecting teachers etc at school. I was s***1T scared of most of the teachers in high school and did what I was told as did most of the kids. The incidents that caused scandels at my school 30 years ago seem like nothing compared to what you hear now.
I have to agree with weg on the quality v quantity of parenting.
For eg:
about 11 years ago a friend and I had a party plan business, (NOT tupperware, our own products, our own business), did very well.
Anyway after about a year into it we got a booking for a woman who lived in the Housing Commision area in a suburb of Newcastle, she made the booking from a party she had attended. Nice woman, dressed a bit like a bikies woman.
Turned out her hubbie was the head honcho of one of the big bikie gangs here!
Anyway, we had finished the party, taken orders and were packing up, (late afternoon/dinner time party). Its about 9pm, its dark, and her 9 year old son comes home on his push bike wheeling another push bike with him.
She flies off the handle and tells the kid "where the fire truck have you been, I told you to come home at 8". He says back " I was out with my mate Johnny and we decided to steal this nice bike we saw this kid riding". Apparently they had seen this kid with a nice bike, decided they wanted it and knocked the kid off his bike and took it.
I thought the mother was going to go off at the child for stealing, but she told him off for being late home. NO MENTION OF THE STOLEN BIKE HE WAS NOW TAKING INTO HIS ROOM
And she was a stay at home mum!
I would be mortified if my child did that.
I have to agree with you gg1965 about kids respecting teachers etc at school. I was s***1T scared of most of the teachers in high school and did what I was told as did most of the kids. The incidents that caused scandels at my school 30 years ago seem like nothing compared to what you hear now.
I have to agree with weg on the quality v quantity of parenting.
For eg:
about 11 years ago a friend and I had a party plan business, (NOT tupperware, our own products, our own business), did very well.
Anyway after about a year into it we got a booking for a woman who lived in the Housing Commision area in a suburb of Newcastle, she made the booking from a party she had attended. Nice woman, dressed a bit like a bikies woman.
Turned out her hubbie was the head honcho of one of the big bikie gangs here!
Anyway, we had finished the party, taken orders and were packing up, (late afternoon/dinner time party). Its about 9pm, its dark, and her 9 year old son comes home on his push bike wheeling another push bike with him.
She flies off the handle and tells the kid "where the fire truck have you been, I told you to come home at 8". He says back " I was out with my mate Johnny and we decided to steal this nice bike we saw this kid riding". Apparently they had seen this kid with a nice bike, decided they wanted it and knocked the kid off his bike and took it.
I thought the mother was going to go off at the child for stealing, but she told him off for being late home. NO MENTION OF THE STOLEN BIKE HE WAS NOW TAKING INTO HIS ROOM
And she was a stay at home mum!
I would be mortified if my child did that.
Like everyone else, I am seriously miffed about the growing violence.
There was a show on ACA or today tonight last night, highlighting how the Victorian Premier Brumby stated he wasn't aware of any gangs in his electorate or Melbourne.
This is a big part of the problem. We have gutless elites running the counrty with no common sense. and the same for the law. Judges and the laws aren't an adequate enough deterrant.
I am a firm believer in zero tolerance for small crime.....as it is the small crims that develop the audacity and insensitivity, to go on and do bigger crime.
Unfortunately, liberal progressive thought differs.
The other cause is an erosion of common decency adn respect for others. I put this down to an erosion of religious (any religion) values.
And these values have not been replaced with something better....just anarchy and existential angst.
People can dump on religious and conservative values all they like, but I for one don't like what they are being replaced with. Some of us are better equipped to deal with life's downside, but others need religion and religious community support to get through. Until elites get that, things will only get worse. And btw, I am not a bible basher nor do I attend a church regularly, but I do respect people who try to live to a prescribed set of noble values. And I know there' sa lot of hypocrisy surrounding religion, but better that than society decaying into anarchy.
IMHO, the erosion and dumbing down of values is directly responsible for
- less home prepared nutrition.
- less stable and supportive family support.
- less personal discipline.
- less establishment of life goals and purpose.
Even if a government spent 500 billion, they couldn't compensate for parents who don't provide this.
BTW, I have friends with kids at the school where the student was stabbed.
And my better half is a teacher at a school 10kms away.
There was a show on ACA or today tonight last night, highlighting how the Victorian Premier Brumby stated he wasn't aware of any gangs in his electorate or Melbourne.
This is a big part of the problem. We have gutless elites running the counrty with no common sense. and the same for the law. Judges and the laws aren't an adequate enough deterrant.
I am a firm believer in zero tolerance for small crime.....as it is the small crims that develop the audacity and insensitivity, to go on and do bigger crime.
Unfortunately, liberal progressive thought differs.
The other cause is an erosion of common decency adn respect for others. I put this down to an erosion of religious (any religion) values.
And these values have not been replaced with something better....just anarchy and existential angst.
People can dump on religious and conservative values all they like, but I for one don't like what they are being replaced with. Some of us are better equipped to deal with life's downside, but others need religion and religious community support to get through. Until elites get that, things will only get worse. And btw, I am not a bible basher nor do I attend a church regularly, but I do respect people who try to live to a prescribed set of noble values. And I know there' sa lot of hypocrisy surrounding religion, but better that than society decaying into anarchy.
IMHO, the erosion and dumbing down of values is directly responsible for
- less home prepared nutrition.
- less stable and supportive family support.
- less personal discipline.
- less establishment of life goals and purpose.
Even if a government spent 500 billion, they couldn't compensate for parents who don't provide this.
BTW, I have friends with kids at the school where the student was stabbed.
And my better half is a teacher at a school 10kms away.
Gotta call horse hockey on that one WW.
It is unquestionaby better to be living today than at any other time of our history.
And it will be better tomorrow.
The good old days weren't.
Each to their own TF.
Maybe you are too young to remember when people left their doors unlocked, Boy Scouts didn't think twice about door knocking for bob a job, parents let little girls sell cordial on the footpath, and a lot of kids had air rifles and 22s, and everyone realized if they kicked, punched, or spat on the police, they'd likely go to jail or get bashed.
I don't know where you grew up TF, but I was never afraid of being on city streets after 11pm on fri and sat nights when younger.....I am now.
What on earth are you talking about?
There was much more thuggery in football 20 years ago, 30 years ago, and not that I remember but further back than that. The game is not getting more violent, it's way less, and it's a good thing too, but your talking crap. Punch-ups used to be a big part of the game, especially league, and I remember when the camera's used to show the fights, and the commentators would cheer it on.
For a spear tackle now you might get a season suspension. Not years ago. For fighting you can get suspended, but years ago players would get taken out of the game from blattent thuggery from the opposition and there would be lucky to be penalised.
Two blokes having a punch up on the footy field is the last thing you should be concerned about. A bit like 20 and 30 years ago when you could have a fair fight with someone, then shake hands 5 minutes later and have a beer together half an hour later. These days some nutso would bring out a knife, or run away and get 20 of his knife weilding mates.
Weird comment.
see ya's.
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I think the problem is that top footballers today have no job, too much time on their hands, are idolised by young women wanting them no matter how they are treated and seemingly can get away with so much.
I don't think it is what happens on the field that is the issue, but what can happen off the field when a young man thinks he can go anything and get away with it because he can play football well.
I don't think it is what happens on the field that is the issue, but what can happen off the field when a young man thinks he can go anything and get away with it because he can play football well.
fear.
instill fear.
bring the singaporean cane in.
watch the crime rate drop after a few ACA specials.
instill fear.
bring the singaporean cane in.
watch the crime rate drop after a few ACA specials.
What's happening in Australia?
A few thoughts
1. Alcohol culture.
Binge drinking has become the norm. Multitude of products avaliable to make it appeal to wider range of people eg. cruisers etc being targetted at young women. Media and sport validating and encouraging this behaviour. Young people binging at an earlier age, bigger binges and more frequently.
2. Illicit drugs
Wider range of drugs avaliable, metamphetamines cheap and available, linked with aggressive behaviour and mental illness
3. Media
Normalisation of porn and violence through internet, gaming and other forms of media even the news! Pop stars, Sports stars lives scrutinised and exposed in minuta. You are not famous if you haven't had some relationship scandal or porn video made of you and circulated on the internet. Think the rise of Paris Hilton, princess of nothing...
4. The me culture
I gotta have that ipod, big screen tv, fast car, fast job, holidays overseas, ..... gotta work 3 jobs to have all this stuff, leaves no time for building connections within the community We have lost our "social capital"
5. Lack of respect for others and lack of responsibility for ones own actions
Seems its always someone elses fault, someone needs to be blamed or someone needs to pay...
That's just a few things off the top of my head. However not so sure it's that different in other western countries though but happy to hear of reports to the contrary!! I am thinking of retiring to someplace else in the world!!
Personal comment on ADD/ADHD from experience in ED and observation of friend that works in kids psychology
For many a mental health diagnosis is better than a behavioural diagnosis - takes the responsibility off the parents and the kids for sorting out the true problem. Better to "fix" it with a pill....
I'm going to side with those that think it's overdiagnosed.
A few thoughts
1. Alcohol culture.
Binge drinking has become the norm. Multitude of products avaliable to make it appeal to wider range of people eg. cruisers etc being targetted at young women. Media and sport validating and encouraging this behaviour. Young people binging at an earlier age, bigger binges and more frequently.
2. Illicit drugs
Wider range of drugs avaliable, metamphetamines cheap and available, linked with aggressive behaviour and mental illness
3. Media
Normalisation of porn and violence through internet, gaming and other forms of media even the news! Pop stars, Sports stars lives scrutinised and exposed in minuta. You are not famous if you haven't had some relationship scandal or porn video made of you and circulated on the internet. Think the rise of Paris Hilton, princess of nothing...
4. The me culture
I gotta have that ipod, big screen tv, fast car, fast job, holidays overseas, ..... gotta work 3 jobs to have all this stuff, leaves no time for building connections within the community We have lost our "social capital"
5. Lack of respect for others and lack of responsibility for ones own actions
Seems its always someone elses fault, someone needs to be blamed or someone needs to pay...
That's just a few things off the top of my head. However not so sure it's that different in other western countries though but happy to hear of reports to the contrary!! I am thinking of retiring to someplace else in the world!!
Personal comment on ADD/ADHD from experience in ED and observation of friend that works in kids psychology
For many a mental health diagnosis is better than a behavioural diagnosis - takes the responsibility off the parents and the kids for sorting out the true problem. Better to "fix" it with a pill....
I'm going to side with those that think it's overdiagnosed.
As I said my view would not be popular considering the country is football crazy and I don't care as I care to please no one. But you have totally missed my point. It is not the game itself, it's actually the culture although the thugs that play the game (not all of them) are what our young people look up to and what we seen last season was appalling, gang rapes, girlfriends and wives getting smashed in the face with glass bottles and glasses, urinating in public, drunk driving and lot's more. They even have cute names for things like "glassing" like it's an acceptable part of Australian life. As is the word "Bashed" it seems bashing someone is just part of life in Australia. All these things come from football. Bashing someone could be as simple as someone lightly punching someone else or it could be bashing someone with a hammer until the have no scull left.
The problem is the culture, the booze, the bashings, the beatings, the excuses, the way of life and the acceptability of all this.
I agree with Batgirl's summary, although, once again, this is merely a personal opinion.
Well done to media outlets and other sources for pushing the "you don't have enough" mentality. We even have a government pushing people to spend, in order to avoid stagflation and ensure GDP is kept at budgeted rates. I recall one government spokesman recently saying how worried the government was because people were saving, instead of spending! Well, duuuuhhh. Didn't we just have a GFC? What did they expect people to do when job security, etc was under threat.
The above wouldn't be too much of an issue if people could avoid "instant gratification", but this is like handing the keys of the distillery to an alcoholic.
Seriously, do we really need a 42 inch plasma????
It's fine to say kids need discipline but who do they look to first? Monkey see, monkey do.
I could go on and on about the benefits of delayed gratification ...
... but I'll talk about that another time
Zargor
Well done to media outlets and other sources for pushing the "you don't have enough" mentality. We even have a government pushing people to spend, in order to avoid stagflation and ensure GDP is kept at budgeted rates. I recall one government spokesman recently saying how worried the government was because people were saving, instead of spending! Well, duuuuhhh. Didn't we just have a GFC? What did they expect people to do when job security, etc was under threat.
The above wouldn't be too much of an issue if people could avoid "instant gratification", but this is like handing the keys of the distillery to an alcoholic.
Seriously, do we really need a 42 inch plasma????
It's fine to say kids need discipline but who do they look to first? Monkey see, monkey do.
I could go on and on about the benefits of delayed gratification ...
... but I'll talk about that another time
Zargor
try buying anything LESS than a 42in and look at the blank stare you get...
LOL - My eldest thinks we live in the dinosaur age because we haven't got a 42" PLasma. Instead we have our nice ten year old dinosaur. Still works darn well.
Regards JO
I believe it started when corporal punishment was taken out of the schools and also out of the homes.Parents could no longer discipline their own kids without threats of arrest.
I still leave my door unlocked.
The issue is always what people experienced versus what they knew. If a bunch of thugs go out at night bashing the chinese/aboriginals/homosexuals, it would lead the news.
40 years ago, if it didn't happen locally, you didn't know about it.
Absolutely horrific crimes were commited against children in various church and state run institutions for decades and "no-one knew". 50 years ago a punch up out the back of the pub was just blokes blowing off steam and giving the missus a quick clip for mouthing of was a "private matter".
The fact that a punch up out the front of a pub now leads the news doesn't mean there was some period prior when this sort of thing didn't happen. My uncle was a bodgie for crying out loud and the same moral panic went on then and since. Sydney in the 50s...geez, the cops were corrupt and there were plenty of places you would't walk during the day, never mind at night. Talk to any detective over the age of 60 in any major capital and have them regale you with stories of the good old days...it's quite an eye opener.
The progress in medical science alone makes the current era a far better place than any time in history.
Fear sells, so fair enough, but facts simply don't support the moral panic.
It didn't then and it doesn't now.
Australian courts are just not imposing decent penalties anymore?
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/terrorists-smile-as-theyre-jailed/story-e6frg6n6-1225830682530
Dunno about you but I prefer today to any other time in the great land of Oz. I can:
- Get a decent cup of coffee or glass of wine.
- Buy calamari, olives and bruschetta without people looking at me funny.
- Get a vast variety of the world's best foods at innumerable restaurants.
- Walk safely at any time on the streets I wish to frequent anyway.
- That is to say - more streets than ever before.
- Get a job as easily as falling over.
- See around me a heap of educated, balanced, articulate and opinionated young people.
- Cycle to work on my bike on dedicated bike paths and have showers and lockers available when I arrive.
- Go swimming at a clean beach, drive and ride on clean roads that are rubbish free (remember the piles on the sides of highways in the 70s/80s?).
- Get excellent medical care at a moment's notice.
- Be of italian heritage without being the butt of jokes, actually it seems to be something of an advantage now!
- I could go on but you get the picture...
Of course it's not perfect and I might be living in a different place to everyone else or something but to me this is the best time to be living in the best country in the world!
Can't think of a better one anyway...
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/terrorists-smile-as-theyre-jailed/story-e6frg6n6-1225830682530
Dunno about you but I prefer today to any other time in the great land of Oz. I can:
- Get a decent cup of coffee or glass of wine.
- Buy calamari, olives and bruschetta without people looking at me funny.
- Get a vast variety of the world's best foods at innumerable restaurants.
- Walk safely at any time on the streets I wish to frequent anyway.
- That is to say - more streets than ever before.
- Get a job as easily as falling over.
- See around me a heap of educated, balanced, articulate and opinionated young people.
- Cycle to work on my bike on dedicated bike paths and have showers and lockers available when I arrive.
- Go swimming at a clean beach, drive and ride on clean roads that are rubbish free (remember the piles on the sides of highways in the 70s/80s?).
- Get excellent medical care at a moment's notice.
- Be of italian heritage without being the butt of jokes, actually it seems to be something of an advantage now!
- I could go on but you get the picture...
Of course it's not perfect and I might be living in a different place to everyone else or something but to me this is the best time to be living in the best country in the world!
Can't think of a better one anyway...
Hear hear!
And more generally, we are but humans, and every day we are blazing an unknown trail, we've got a lot wrong but we've got a lot right too.
I don't think things are getting worse, but paranoia and fear are rife.
I believe it started when corporal punishment was taken out of the schools and also out of the homes.Parents could no longer discipline their own kids without threats of arrest.
Has anyone you know been arrested for smacking their child?
I can't think of anyone I know.....
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